I have a 12 year old boy that pulls way outside the body. His entry is good just not the pull. I have tried everything I know, looking for some ideas on how to help the swimmer?
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- -. •
As long as he is using his momentum to come forward into a high
elbow/fingertips down catch, an outward sweep can be good, since he will
be holding the water with his forearm and upper arm. You just have to
make sure he is rotating side to side from the hips. I would use one
arm drills, both with the non-pulling hand forward and at the side, so
he can concentrate on each phase of the pull and work the kick at the
same time.
Manta Ray Swim Club •
does he pull as if he swims water polo one way i have found works is
zippier drill and long reach, far stretches in front and use the black
line for the swimmer as a train track these are some of the stuff I have
tried and it works
Bob Steele •
Use a catch-up tube (PVC or dowel) with a slice of inner-tube on the
ankles so they cannot kick and explain the hand MUST come to the
center-line of the body, between the body and the lane-marker. Find
Phelps U/W on YouTube and they'll see it happen.
Have 3 work together correcting each other. They'll learn more teaching than being taught. 3/lane; 2 @25 and 1 opposite. 1 of the 2 swims the 25 and gets critiqued. Then they just keep rotating getting help on hand placement from teammates. Check out www.gamesgimmickschallenges.com
Have 3 work together correcting each other. They'll learn more teaching than being taught. 3/lane; 2 @25 and 1 opposite. 1 of the 2 swims the 25 and gets critiqued. Then they just keep rotating getting help on hand placement from teammates. Check out www.gamesgimmickschallenges.com
Jennifer Deschler •
One analogy I have used before is to have a swimmer thinking about
his/her stroke as sweeping the hand to put something in your "pocket."
This way, he'll get the idea of not allowing his fingertips to scale
upwards but continue a downwards motion. Plus, his stroke will be less
outside of his body and closer to his frame.
Ann Shenck Dallam •
Is he far enough on his side when he starts to pull/sweep, and are his
fingertips pointing toward the bottom?
Andrew Sellers •
Depends on the style of freestyle you are teaching. I teach over the
barrel freestyle. We work on stay in the number 11 position. This
means the swimmer will in a wider position engaging the delts. I use
single arm free with the hand at the side with a snorkel. Because of
the type of freestyle I teach I stay away from the zipper drill and
thumb drag along body line. I also use 12-18" long and .5-1" diameter
wooden dowels to get them to feel that initial catch position. The most
important things are to get him to establish and early vertical
forearm, finish at the hip and relax his arm during the recovery. That
slightly outside position is good to establish high hand speed.
Bob Steele •
Use an 8' piece of surgical (see Amazon,com) with Hans Paddles attached
(see HansPaddles.com) Draw the desired stroke pattern on the pool deck
with sidewalk chalk (it washes off) and have the swimmer follow the
chalk line you drew. They bend at the waist with the tubing attached
mid-way on a ladder, bleacher, or diving standard.
Also, see at www.gamesgimmickschallenges.com/stroke gear and make your own.
Also, see at www.gamesgimmickschallenges.com/stroke gear and make your own.
Fr. Jim LaCasse, S.J. •
If you have a pool with the deck about a foot above the water, have the
swimmer while in the water put his hands on the deck with the middle
fingers just touching and lift himself as high as he can. Then have him
put his hands on the deck with his hands outside his shoulders the same
distance they are as he swims. Now have him lift himself as high as he
can. Hopefully he will see that the outside arm position does not lift
him as high nor is it as powerful. This may serve as a motivation for
improving his mechanics.
Bob Steele •
Liked the last one. Here's one I do with kids. Stand next to the
swimmer with their elbows at 90 degrees at the shoulder as if do an
freestyle in-sweep and finish. Use your pinky to prevent them from
pulling and finishing. The center the hand on the mid-line and you'll
need your index finger or hand to prevent a finish. Then fall down with
they push properly.
Also change terminology from changing the PULL to using a PUSH from the entry. Use 1,000 words and by season's end they'll say, OH is that what you mean!
Bob
Also change terminology from changing the PULL to using a PUSH from the entry. Use 1,000 words and by season's end they'll say, OH is that what you mean!
Bob
Greg Davis •
In my Flippers flipbook, you'll see that Sheila Taormina pulls a little
wider than the shoulder line, but is very nicely engaged through her
upper body and core. video clip here: (www.goflippers.com). In
Sheila's book- Swim Speed Secrets she describes a great drill demo'd by
Allison Schmitt- Single Arm Catch-Up holding a Kickboard in front with
Head Up. I use this drill to work on the entry/catch.
Michael Collins •
Have you video taped him and shown him what he looks like? I just use my
iPhone for overwater and a GoPro on a stick for underwater and the
quick feedback helps them understand the difference between what they
think they are doing and REALLY doing.
Charlie Lownes •
I put a hose in the water and have them pull along the rope/hose be
careful to go Slow or they drop the elbow
Bob Steele •
Tie a rope to a ladder on the 4th rung down and attach it tight to one
across the pool. Tie knots in the rope every 5'. Have the swimmers
workout on the rope as part of a drill session or circuit. Made one at
Rattler Swim Club in CA and all the swimmers now use it. Just go to
Home Depot and find the supplies to make posts if ladders don't exist.
Had a kid drop from 47.9 to 44.5 and while he also trained hard the only
skill change was from swimming on the rope EVERY MORNING with gloves on
to protect his hands. Stroke count/25 went from 21 to 14. Power is
under the body.
Eric Kramer •
You can try and get the swimmer to swim really close to the wall, this
will give him a great sense of what direction his arm is going... the
goal being not to hit the wall.
Anita K. •
Teaching vs coaching? The lines are blurred. I get in the water with
my swimmers and physically manipulate them into the desired movement
patterns. It's full proof! I have a long wide step that the swimmer
can lie on submerged about 12"/30cm that allows me to take them through
the full range of movement on one arm. I can address almost any stroke
fault if I am in the water with them.
Also, try lying them on the wet deck edge as close to the edge as possible with one arm in the water pulling through the movement. Use the edge of the pool as their frame of reference as it should roughly run their centre line. (It will be a bit off centre, but good enough for what you want). THeir hand entry should be right in front of their shoulder line, then make their catch and pull with their thumb staying in touch with the wall. Once they can do this and have a feel for where the hand should be you can add in any out/in sweeps according to your stroke philosophy, as long as they bring the hand back and touch the wall somewhere under their bellybutton.
I will do this kneeling to the side of them and moving their arm through the movement, but will get in the water too if necessary.
Work through each of the different learning styles. Chances are you are not triggering their learning preference. Some like to know the facts - the why's; Some are visual and need demo's, pictures, video analysis; some are kinaesthetic and need more manipulation while some are auditory processes who follow instructions well. I am a high visual/kinaesthetic learner so following spoken instructions (made even harder if the teacher has poor communication skills) takes me longer to process.
Hope this helps, you just need to get creative...
Also, try lying them on the wet deck edge as close to the edge as possible with one arm in the water pulling through the movement. Use the edge of the pool as their frame of reference as it should roughly run their centre line. (It will be a bit off centre, but good enough for what you want). THeir hand entry should be right in front of their shoulder line, then make their catch and pull with their thumb staying in touch with the wall. Once they can do this and have a feel for where the hand should be you can add in any out/in sweeps according to your stroke philosophy, as long as they bring the hand back and touch the wall somewhere under their bellybutton.
I will do this kneeling to the side of them and moving their arm through the movement, but will get in the water too if necessary.
Work through each of the different learning styles. Chances are you are not triggering their learning preference. Some like to know the facts - the why's; Some are visual and need demo's, pictures, video analysis; some are kinaesthetic and need more manipulation while some are auditory processes who follow instructions well. I am a high visual/kinaesthetic learner so following spoken instructions (made even harder if the teacher has poor communication skills) takes me longer to process.
Hope this helps, you just need to get creative...
Exergenie® Research •
Marry his balance line (head-spine line) to his rhythm line and direct
his energies outward towards his hands and feet, the force creators.
Then, his hips will not bounce, his hands will not sweep out, and he
will not need to crossover kick to compensate for his head every time he
takes an breathe.
Technique errors, such as sweeping the hand out wide are only a reflection of mistakes on his balance line/rhythm line.
Technique errors, such as sweeping the hand out wide are only a reflection of mistakes on his balance line/rhythm line.
Allyson Sega •
Also on the dryland theme- if you can find a bench, have him lie down on
his stomach and do the pulls. The bench will give him an idea of where
his hands are compared to his body. It's a little harder to get a good
roll in while on the bench but I think the visual is worth it. If you
have the money- a vasa trainer is an expensive way to replacate this
idea.
Exergenie® Research •
Or, you could use the Exergenie Swim Trainer to teach him about the BIG 4
of a good catch...as per photo. That is... if you want to not teach him
to swim the "Balance Line"
www.exergenie.com
www.exergenie.com
Dan Lynch •
I think Video will show hm, and specific training. A video is worth
10,000 strokes in the pool. Take a week with video, 5 sessions, at the
5th session, you wont think its the same kid.
Have him swim "Coach Eric's freestyle", provide immediate feedback deckside, dont wait, and video again. 4 or 5 corrections views in each session.
You can swim other strokes in practice, but only train to correct the one fault. Let me know how you do.
Have him swim "Coach Eric's freestyle", provide immediate feedback deckside, dont wait, and video again. 4 or 5 corrections views in each session.
You can swim other strokes in practice, but only train to correct the one fault. Let me know how you do.
Jon Selby •
Agree with Dan - one thing worth trying (although a bit risky) is what I
call "compensation swimming" - literally to get someone to do the
opposite of what they are doing.
Water is 800 X's denser then air, so what we feel in the water (our proprioception) is usually not accurate.You may , for example, be instructing this boy to straighten his pull under the water - he may think (feel) that he is!
So instead, tell him that you want him to pull in such a way that his hands arrive under his torso - literally exaggerating the movement to the extreme of the continuum. In most cases swimmers think they are doing what you request but because of the "holes" in their proprioception they actually end up doing the very action you require of them :)
Water is 800 X's denser then air, so what we feel in the water (our proprioception) is usually not accurate.You may , for example, be instructing this boy to straighten his pull under the water - he may think (feel) that he is!
So instead, tell him that you want him to pull in such a way that his hands arrive under his torso - literally exaggerating the movement to the extreme of the continuum. In most cases swimmers think they are doing what you request but because of the "holes" in their proprioception they actually end up doing the very action you require of them :)
Eric Kramer •
here is something: get the child to pull free without moving forward. I
call it Tai-chi swim. He can then observe and correct the hand path.
Andrew...
Check out www.gamesgimmickschallenges/stroke gear for a picture of the tubing/paddles.
The term balance is commonly used in swimming but does not really describe dynamic balance or first-class leverage as Bill intended. Below is the meaning of balance in swimming as told to me by Professor Bill Boomer’...
Balance is a sensitivity that can be developed statically or dynamically. A swimming stroke could have vertical, horizontal and even rotational balance.
What naturally happens to your body in the water when you hold your breath and do nothing, when you just hang there and float? Some peoples' bodies will assume a low-hanging, almost vertical, dead man's float.
Obviously, the nearly vertical dead man's float and those positions in between are not very streamlined, as gravity pulls the heaviest parts of your body downward.
You will find that the most buoyant part of your body is between your armpits and the heaviest part is somewhere around the belt buckle. You have the choice about what floats and you need to counteract the force of gravity to bring your body into a relaxed, streamlined position, without using heartbeats (kicking) to do it.
Think of your body as a long lever arm like a see saw. The length of the balancing line in the lever system of your body runs from the point of your extended finger tips to your extended toes and includes your head/spine line.
A see saw is in balance when both ends are unsupported, stabilized, and motionless. The equation does not require equal lengths and weights on both sides of the balancing point. To balance, you need equal products: the relationships between length and weight.
The same conditions apply to the human body when trying to balance. To accomplish this, you need to be able to shift your center of mass towards your center of flotation.
This necessitates that you connect the product of the weight and length of your hips and legs on one side of the see saw to the following on the other side:
The product of the weight and length of your arms
The weight of your head
A downward pressure on the head/chest unit
The closer these two points, the less potential torque is in your system.
Creating and understanding this balanced system will eliminate the need to kick your body into a streamlined position. It also gives you a more stable base or platform from which to freely direct your arms.
In freestyle swimming, this establishes a rhythm line where the cycling rhythm (stroke rate) can originate at your hips - a critical condition for being able to change velocities in freestyle swimming.
When you swim you have subconsciously adjusted your kick, shifted your head weight, or used your leading hand/arm unit (platforming) to counterbalance technique errors. You have had to do this because your rhythm center has been located in your hands.
Wrong! If pace changes occur in the force-creating units (hands and feet) it will destroy the balance rhythm and posture; it puts the 'cart before the horse!'
Freestyle rhythm changes occur at your hips... and they never interfere with your balance or posture. You will need to evaluate the impact of any such change on your entire body - your hips, your head, your legs, your arms - as that change impacts your balance rhythm and posture.
We all have a natural rhythm to our stroke and that rhythm manifests itself along our balancing line which includes the head/spine and hips if we are to create this rhythm line.
We can then marry our own balance line (head-spine line) to our rhythm line and direct our energies outward towards our hands and feet, the force creators. Our hips will not bounce, our hands will not sweep out, and we will not need to crossover kick to compensate for our head every time we breathe.
.
As you know, the Shoulder Driven technique is normally utilised by sprinters but, I have seen Lotte Friis and David Davis use this technique during their 1500m swims. It requires the swimmer to have a quicker catch of their entry hand and a quicker release... thus, creating more arm strokes but with less time to rotate the hips.
Therefore, not as much power can be generated off each arm pull, but since there are so many more of them, it is the frequency that makes up the difference. Usually the shoulder rotates more than the hips with this technique, thus the name.
The best way to explain the technique that Bill and Milt are recommending can be thought of as a like walking...
When we walk or run, we basically anchor our foot down onto the ground and swing our body and our centre of mass past this fixed anchoring point. We then place our other foot down anchor it to the ground then swing the other side of our body past this new anchor.
The idea is for the swimmer to drop their arm into the water, anchor it onto the water then via rotation of the swimmers lower core combined with the swinging action of the other arm... swing themselves over that anchor, release it then placing another anchor down with our other arm. They then repeat these processes down the length of the pool.
This type of freestyle becomes potentially a very light stroke that utilizes the forces of Mother Nature – gravity and momentum that combine together with the rotary power of our mass over our anchor point.
This means that the technique Bill is teaching around the world is very much a Top side dominated stroke, because he wants the swimmer to utilize the mass of their body that rotates and falls into the water coupled with the mass of their arm swinging over into the water to transfer through their body to the established anchor as we they over it.
The recovery side (Top side) of the stroke utilizes the free energy from gravity and momentum that can be used on the Low side by maintaining the weight of the swimmers arm in the Front Quadrant whilst swimming. The swimmer will thus have a greater ability to balance in the water.
Watch this video of Shelly Ripple with the late Richard Quick of Stanford... after showing and telling the viewer why a swimmer should not use the 'Zipper Drill" Shelly swims a few laps full stroke emphasising all the above points
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxKK7Wed9jg